Defend the Wall beta!

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by darkwulfv on Mon Mar 23, 2009 3:28 am

-Frost Hero's revive doesnt work, Fire's hero does.
Already documented.

you can't move onto the next wave unless you kill it.
I'm almost positive this has already been fixed, but I'll look into it.

I think it might be a BIT too easy. Tried it on solo and with two
players. Both times, we were never close to being pushed back to the
actual wall.
Hmm... Balance has been tough to, well, balance. It's either too hard or too easy. Since I'm revamping the terrain into 2 levels before the walls and increasing the spawn amounts, things may change.

-Fighter mentioned to me something about the middle portal on the very bottom didn't work.
It's not supposed to, it's there for show (for when forces inside the city are summoned for reinforcement)

-If you plan on putting in items, will 20 seconds between waves really be enough time for players?
I don't know. I'll probably increase it, but I want people's decisions to go back for items to be strategic.


Fewmets, I can't seem to stack the barricades like you say is possible. I can only place them directly next to each other, not one on top of each other.

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Fewmets on Mon Mar 23, 2009 3:51 am

its hard because you have to get the guy in just the right place. this is because you need to be in the build box but outside the collision box and then build since it doesn't stop more 'cades from being built just stops the builder from moving onto them to build them.

Fix - make them unstackable. (I don't know why you don't just do this anyway but w/e)

[Edit you can figure out "'build/repair' boxing" by having him repair a barricade. this will give you where the 'cade does its check for a unit with state building. To figure out the "Collission Boxing", well... if you have to ask you'll never figure it out.]

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by darkwulfv on Mon Mar 23, 2009 4:42 am

Except in the world editor, i cannot place two barricades over each other no matter how hard I try. Their collison size and pathing map match up to make that impossible O.o However, I'll double the collision size just to be sure.

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Fighter_Wolf on Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:12 pm

Also, notably, you do NOT have to fall back when the second line of cades starts going down. One thing that Moo forgot to mention from when we played, is that we intentionally made a gap at the far left of the cades (So I could get the melee out after teleport bugged and stopped working). All of the aliens made a bee-line for it, didn't attack any other cades, bottlenecked and got slaughtered. By holding that as a choke point we didn't lose a single unit after that. Well, except for flying.


Another point: The Frost hero's damage reduction decreases incoming damage by 55 on 80% of attacks. But none of the aliens actually do 55 damage... So it just blocks 4/5 of attacks.

The Frost hero's single target spell seems like a waste of mana more or less. For its cost, cooldown and damage, it's not worth it to stun/damage a single target when there are no real boss waves. The area attack is much more efficient for its mana cost (Especially when using melee, as they circle up around you. You can nuke half a wave in one attack)

I'm a big fan of beefing up your hero rather than building units. So on a more personal note, please try to make the filler items at least SOMEWHAT useful Sad
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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by darkwulfv on Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:44 am

But none of the aliens actually do 55 damage... So it just blocks 4/5 of attacks.
It does have a minimum value that attacks must do. And besides, since this is a demo you're not at a point where the spawns would do that much anyways =P

True, Frigid Bolt isn't worth its weight in mana. If you have an idea for a spell, don't hesitate to suggest.

I'm trying to think of a way to make the cades have a higher attack priority and prevent that annoying bottleneck. I'm considering staggering them so that when one is destroyed a hole opens up, but I'm not sure.

And don't worry, the filler items will be at least semi usable =P

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Mooo-Gunsniper on Tue Mar 24, 2009 3:02 am

Maybe you could do what all those other maps do and give barracades a 0 or 1 damage attack? NPC tends to attack anything that DOES attack.

Maybe you could replace frigid bolt with one of those "enhancing autocast attacks"? (You know, searing/frost arrows, that stuff) Probably something that increases damage and slows them with a small chance to freeze them for x seconds?

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by darkwulfv on Tue Mar 24, 2009 3:45 am

Hm, i hadn't thought of giving them an attack. I could even remove the UI so its hidden. Hmmm...

I'm considering giving him a passive/autocast ability. I don't want it to be a passive slow or attack enhancer though.

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Fighter_Wolf on Tue Mar 24, 2009 2:38 pm

Is there any way to keep the snipers from all targetting the same enemy at once, and wasting all their headshot mana for a single kill? Maybe a randomized attack range (between 1400 and 1800?) on spawn and/or a faster projectile? So they don't just shoot the first one to enter their field of vision and that's that? And perhaps a scope (the line of sight increase one) as one of the items, so that massive range goes to some use, rather than cutting of with field of vision?
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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Fewmets on Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:10 pm

attack range CANNOT be dynamically set.

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Fighter_Wolf on Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:28 pm

D:

Even if the spawn randomly selects one of several different units, each of which has a different, fixed range?
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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by sniperwolf777 on Tue Mar 24, 2009 6:22 pm

Reinstalled wc3 just for this. Now im back to make your life hell Very Happy
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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Fewmets on Tue Mar 24, 2009 8:50 pm

fighter i said it cannot be dynamically changed. it could spawn one of multiple of the same units with different range but then it would add an element of luck into gameplay and strategy =/= luck.

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Mooo-Gunsniper on Tue Mar 24, 2009 8:58 pm

Maybe it was because we had a choke point in that last game, meaning we grouped up all our snipers in 1 small area.

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by darkwulfv on Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:06 pm

No, I know what he means and I've seen it happen. However, with the new terrain (and thus new soldier placement) this problem will be, at least in part, solved. Unless you spam a bunch of snipers. Not much I can do to help there =/

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Firemonkey on Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:45 pm

Ok so what i want to know is that if its defend the wall then where are all the civilians that should be in the city who need protection? And am i to assume that the soldiers we see are really the military force or conscription because you might want to add a simple police force to the city as well.
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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by darkwulfv on Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:46 pm

...Did you look in the city? There's civilians waltzing around and soldiers posted about.

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Firemonkey on Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:49 pm

I couldn't remember jeez but what about the police?
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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by darkwulfv on Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:51 pm

meh. Maybe.

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Firemonkey on Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:08 pm

I also want you to consider the possibility of difficulty modes like in eota. Like keep doing the waves but perhaps have a game end at a given time prior to what the host wants.
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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by Mooo-Gunsniper on Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:15 pm

You might already have this planned but maybe put in more "special" waves. Right now in your beta you've only got melee, ranged, and flying. Make your enemies somewhat more unique. Razz

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

Post by darkwulfv on Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:35 pm

Of course there will be other unique waves. I plan on doing abilities and the sort. It'll be cool Very Happy

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Re: Defend the Wall beta!

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